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#1747925
Celexia
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HELP! New Alligator Lizard Keeper! 
Hi, I am a brand new lizard keeper. My husband and I have a wild-caught Northern Alligator Lizard (how it got to southern California is beyond me) that we suspect is a female, but since the lady at the reptile store said it was small we’re not 100% sure. Right now we have kind of a basic vivarium, a 5 gallon converted fish tank with some brown substrate that came in cake form that had to be re-hydrated in order to be spread about, an under tank heating pad, screen top, basking lamp, plastic rock/cave and a food and a water dish. Also, we picked up some Anole dust on advice from the lady at the reptile store to dust the crickets we’ve been trying to feed her/him. We’ve only had her for a day, but she’s already eaten 2 out of the 5 crickets we’ve put in her cage (since our original assumption is that it’s female, I’ll just refer to it as female). Oh, we did also make sure to get a thermometer/hydrometer. She is missing part of her tail, will that grow back? Are there any plants that we need to get for the cage? I know a larger cage would probably be better for her, but we’re military so we’re kind of limited on how much space we have that we can set aside for exotic pets, we do have a 10 gallon aquarium that is clean and able to be converted, would that be a better size for her? Also, what’s the best temperature gradient to keep the cage at? And if it is female, is there any way to determine if she’s pregnant before she gives birth? We caught her after the breeding season was over, and since she is wild-caught I believe that it is a possibility that she may be pregnant if it is female. Is it possible to acclimate her enough so that she’ll allow me to handle her easily instead of running away and hiding whenever I open the top of her cage to change her water or add crickets to her food dish? I just want to do the best I can to make her thrive and keep her healthy. She is missing part of her tail, but she’s still nice and fat, no mucus coming out of her nose, breathes easily no gasping or panting, her mouth is clear and pink, she flicks her tongue frequently, and she’s got clear eyes and no bumps or lifted scales, so all indications (that I am aware of at least) are that she’s a nice healthy specimen. Also, if I were to get a mate for her, how many babies would she give birth to, and is it possible to keep both male and female lizards in the same vivarium? Any advice would be MORE than welcome and truly appreciated. I will post some pictures of what we’ve got set up so far when I get the camera working with my computer (electronics don’t work well with me). Thank you all in advance for your help and advice.
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05/27/08 10:34am
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#1747988
Celexia
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Message To: Celexia In reference to Message Id: 1747925
HELP! New Alligator Lizard Keeper!
I thought of another question for y’all’s consideration, I am going to be out of town this summer for 6 weeks, will my lizard travel well on the plane with me and my cats (we’ve got 2 3-year old cats), or should I find someone to lizard-sit for those 6 weeks? If it will be OK on the plane, what’s the protocol for taking reptiles on airplanes? Do I check it in with the cats (separate carrier of course), or do I keep it with me when I board and keep an eye on it that way?
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05/27/08 12:16pm
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#1748003
L1z4rds rul3!
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Message To: Celexia In reference to Message Id: 1747988
HELP! New Alligator Lizard Keeper!
Hi there! You sound like you’re on the right track as far as the tank setup is going, but I would suggest the 10 gallon. She shouldn’t need anything bigger than that. Do you have a UVB lamp? They need it to help with calcium and all that. LIke artificial sunlight. Yes, a lizard sitter would be best, becuase I don’t think you can take native reptiles out of California. My cousin managed to smuggle one out as a carryon a few years back, but it was a sand lizard and very tiny. We didn’t know if it was illegal or not then.
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05/27/08 12:45pm
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#1748052
Celexia
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Message To: L1z4rds rul3! In reference to Message Id: 1748003
HELP! New Alligator Lizard Keeper!
We did pick up a UVB lamp for her, I’d done a little bit of research prior to visiting the reptile store and since all of y’all were so adamant about UVB lamps being the best thing for them, I made sure to get one. My little lizard seems to have a healthy appetite now that she’s had a day to get used to her new home, she’s wolfed down 10 small to medium sized crickets since we set up the cage at 6pm yesterday, and she’s perked up, I almost got bit when I went to change her water this morning. All of these are good signs I’m assuming? The substrate we got for her was "bed-a-beast" is this an appropriate substrate or should we get something else to use? How often should we change her substrate? Oh, she also had her first poop this morning too, that was exciting for me. If you can’t tell already, this is my very first experience keeping any type of reptile. How big will she grow, maximum size once her tail is regenerated? Sorry if I’m asking so many questions, the books I got at the reptile store didn’t have much information on native species, most of their information was pertaining to the exotics, and the native species were more like a footnote which was rather discouraging. I’m also still working on getting my camera and computer cooperating so that I can post some pictures both of the tank and her, she’s a beautiful gal, and once her tail comes back, she’ll be even prettier.
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05/27/08 02:18pm
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#1748092
L1z4rds rul3!
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Message To: Celexia In reference to Message Id: 1748052
 HELP! New Alligator Lizard Keeper!
She sounds healthy to me! Do you have a picture that you could post on the forum yet? I’d like to see her. That’s funny, that you are all excited about the poop, soon you’ll be sick of having to clean up! As far as cleaning up goes, I would say as long as you spot clean everyday and pick up dead crix and the water doesn’t spill, you could probably get away with totally new bedding every month and a half, two months if it’s a big tank.
Allies do get pretty big, 20 inches average adult size counting the tail. Keep in mind that they have very long tails. Mine is only five inches, but he lost his tail and should be much longer. How big is your alli? (measure from snout to vent length, no tail) My alli is only 3" svl. Here’s a picture of him. His name is Jo. Have you named yours yet?
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05/27/08 02:54pm
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#1748184
PrinceSushi
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Message To: Celexia In reference to Message Id: 1747925
HELP! New Alligator Lizard Keeper!
Ah. Lets see if I can pick all of the questions out and answer them.
POST1
If you can get picture of the head, we should be able to figure out if it is male or female.
5 gallons is not enough for an allie. 10 is ok for a juvenile, but a 20 long should be provided once they are older.
Best a beast is perfectly fine and exactly what I use. Just make sure you go through it before placing it in the tank, some junk and pebbles can make its way into the mix.
Get rid of the UTH. Its not needed and not suitable for such a tank. A bulb, roughly 60 watts, that is able to reach 95 degrees should be provided for basking.
I’m not sure about anole dust. What brand is it? Try buying Rep-Cal and Herptivite. They are the best out there.
Eating 3-5 crickets a day is the average. Less or more may be offered depending on your lizards mood.
What type of hydrometer and thermometer did you get? Those stick on dial types aren’t worth the stuff they are made of. Be sure you have a digital probe.
The tail will grow back, but it won’t look as nice or be as long as an intact tail.
No plants are needed, but you can offer them. I personally have no plants, only rocks and wood, but I own a southern. You could try getting some type of vine/bamboo plant. She might like it.
Cool side should be roughly 75-80 degree, warm side should range between 85-90 degrees, with a basking spot of 95.
If she is pregnant, the best way to find out is through a vet examination. Other than that, its a wait and see for most case.
No, she will never be 100% ok with being touched, especially if she is an older specimen. Allies are always nervous around people and should not be forced to be held, unless for examinations or transportation.
In order to breed California native species you will need a propagation license and a sports fishing license in order to collect the male. They will both need to go through brumation in order to breed next year.
POST2
I’m not sure about how it goes for native pets, but any breeders, must have an import/export licence and proof of domestication. Not to mention you will also have to check other state laws. You may or may not be told that it can’t go, it all depends. It would be best to hire a herp experienced pet sitter.
POST3
Yes, biting is generally a good sign. It means she is alert and comfortable enough in her new habbitat to protect it, rather than run.
You should change your substrate at LEAST every 6 months. 3 is recommended.
Well, northerns are rather small. With an intact tail you would be looking at roughly 10 inches, and with a damaged tail, about 6-8 inches. 20 inches is not possible with northerns. Some southerns can get close to that though.
Hope that helps.
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05/27/08 04:03pm
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#1748235
Celexia
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Message To: PrinceSushi In reference to Message Id: 1748184
HELP! New Alligator Lizard Keeper!
I do have a name for her picked out, 2 names actually, one male one female, just in case, the female name is Emmy the male name is Oscar. Since she is a tongue flicker, the name "flicks" originally came to mind, then I got to thinking that movies are often called "flicks" so I picked the names of the awards that are given by the movie industry. It makes sense and is kind of an obscure reference. The anole dust is an Insect Coating Balancer by T-rex, I did just recently come from the store, and I picked up a calcium supplement: ReptoCal for all reptiles with calcium and vitamin D3. The hydrometer/thermometer i got was one of the stick on digital types  Will it be OK if I left it as is until the next time I go to get crickets to feed her? I really truly appreciate everyone’s helpful advice and encouragement. I should have a picture of both the tank and my allie later today that I can post.
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05/27/08 04:32pm
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#1748272
Celexia
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Message To: Celexia In reference to Message Id: 1748235
HELP! New Alligator Lizard Keeper!
OK, I’ve got pictures, let’s see if I can get them uploaded here. 
This is the tank set up I’ve got so far. The others are all varying top views of her, hopefully someone might be able to identify whether she’s male or female.
These are all the photos I have of her right now. I’ll add more as her tail grows back.
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05/27/08 05:12pm
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#1748279
Celexia
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Message To: Celexia In reference to Message Id: 1748272
HELP! New Alligator Lizard Keeper!
Oh, I forgot, her svl is about 4 - 4 1/2 inches.
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05/27/08 05:18pm
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#1748366
L1z4rds rul3!
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Message To: Celexia In reference to Message Id: 1748279
HELP! New Alligator Lizard Keeper!
I find plants helpful in keeping the humdity up, but they aren’t necesary. Usually at most 99cent stores ar dollar stores they have nice plants. nice cage so far
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05/27/08 06:45pm
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#1748693
PrinceSushi
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Message To: L1z4rds rul3! In reference to Message Id: 1748366
HELP! New Alligator Lizard Keeper!
I’d say stop using the anole stuff. I don’t know much about it, but I do know that the bearded dragon power that T-Rex makes can have some pretty bad side effects on lizards, including death.
As for the thermometer. As long as your allie is eating, she should be fine until your next cricket run.
Is that tank still the 5 gallon? Its so tiny! Definitely upgrade as soon as you can. For right now it is ok, she needs to be quarantined and monitored after all, but its no fair to expect her to live like that long term.
Look into some more hides as well. It doesn’t have to be plants, but just something she can hide around and under to feel safe.
Your lizard is a southern, not a northern. I’m 100% positive. It also looks like a female, and a young one at that. She still has her juvenile colors.
Southern.
Northern.
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05/27/08 10:31pm
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#1748709
Celexia
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Message To: PrinceSushi In reference to Message Id: 1748693
HELP! New Alligator Lizard Keeper!
Thanks for the clarifications. She’s been quite the piglet, she’s had 18 crickets in the last 24 hours, is that because she’s still growing, or because she’s gravid? Should I look into placing something for her to lay eggs in in her cage?
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05/27/08 10:39pm
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#1748714
PrinceSushi
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Message To: Celexia In reference to Message Id: 1748709
HELP! New Alligator Lizard Keeper!
No, I doubt she is gravid. She looks too young. She is probably almost a year old, and most don’t breed until 2-3 years of age. If she gets really large though, just keep your dirt moist and allow her to dig. She will lay them right in the substrate. You can then toss the eggs or feed them to her for a protein boost.
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05/27/08 10:44pm
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#1748723
Celexia
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Message To: PrinceSushi In reference to Message Id: 1748714
HELP! New Alligator Lizard Keeper!
OK, thank you so much for all your help. I really appreciate it. And since she’s female, her name is definitely going to be Emmy.
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05/27/08 10:52pm
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#1749121
Celexia
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Message To: Celexia In reference to Message Id: 1748723
HELP! New Alligator Lizard Keeper!
Quick question.... How many crickets is normal to feed a juvenile? Emmy has been eating every single cricket I put in her cage within 15 minutes, and I’ve been putting 5 in at a time. So far, in the last 24 hours, she’s had ~28 crickets. Is that too many to feed her or does she need the extra food because she’s still young and is regrowing her tail?
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05/28/08 01:29pm
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#1749133
PrinceSushi
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Message To: Celexia In reference to Message Id: 1749121
HELP! New Alligator Lizard Keeper!
28 crickets at once is a bit much for her size. Try to bring it down to about 10 once a day, or at least 10 in the morning and 10 at night.
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05/28/08 01:46pm
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#1749165
Celexia
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Message To: PrinceSushi In reference to Message Id: 1749133
HELP! New Alligator Lizard Keeper!
OK, thanks again for your help.
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05/28/08 02:25pm
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#1749881
Aliceinwl
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Message To: Celexia In reference to Message Id: 1749165
HELP! New Alligator Lizard Keeper!
With an SVL of 4" she should be sexually mature and could be gravid. I would make sure that you keep a moist hide available to her (a hiding place where the substrate stays moist). If you flip her over and look at her chin, you should still be able to make out a large faint gray "U" shaped scar from the male holding her by the head if she bred this season.
If she lays, you can put the eggs in something like one of those ziplock food storage containers, bury them about 2/3rds of the way in moist (not wet) vermiculite (bed-a-beast would work too), and put them somewhere where the temperature stays relatively constant in the low to mid 70’s / room temperature. Be careful to put the eggs in the container in the same orientation you found them in. Open the container once a week for air exchange. If you notice lots of large hanging drops on the lid, wipe them off (it means your substrate was a little too moist and you don’t want the drops raining on the eggs). In about two months you should have bunch of baby als. You can keep one to raise up and adopt out the rest. They’re very cute, and captive hatched als tend to grow into super tame adults.
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05/29/08 05:13am
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#1750139
Celexia
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Message To: Aliceinwl In reference to Message Id: 1749881
HELP! New Alligator Lizard Keeper!
I just made a discovery this morning, I was adding some fake plants to the cage to provide more hiding places, and in order to place them in a way to allow enough space to move and climb I picked up Emmy and she had her hemipenes poking out of her vent. At least I think they were hemipenes, they were two fleshy prominences poking out of the vent and when I put her back in the cage, they were gone. So, now I’m assuming that Emmy is actually male based on that finding. If that’s the case, then her name will actually be Oscar. Or, I should say, HIS name will be Oscar.
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05/29/08 03:10pm
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#1750364
William kimmy
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Message To: Celexia In reference to Message Id: 1750139
HELP! New Alligator Lizard Keeper!
what happened to his tail?you didn’t grab it or anythiing did you? 
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05/29/08 06:59pm
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#1750404
Celexia
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Message To: William kimmy In reference to Message Id: 1750364
HELP! New Alligator Lizard Keeper!
He was missing his tail when we got him. I think either my kitties were playing with him, or a bird attacked him before he came in our house and we "adopted" him.
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05/29/08 07:33pm
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#1750469
PrinceSushi
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Message To: Celexia In reference to Message Id: 1750139
HELP! New Alligator Lizard Keeper!
That always the best way to sex them. lol.
Yours just doesn’t look male from the pictures, then again some can have small heads and some have very prominent triangles.
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05/29/08 08:36pm
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#1750650
Celexia
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Message To: PrinceSushi In reference to Message Id: 1750469
HELP! New Alligator Lizard Keeper!
Maybe his head will become more triangular as he gets older?
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05/29/08 11:17pm
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