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 #2089824


Edf
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 Info Post: Snake miscarried ( gross pic warning)

what a freaking night!

Just got back from the vets- I saw something OI have never seen before in my one snakes cage. Never read anything about it, couldnt tell what end it came from or anything! I couldnt even speculate what it was.

I saved the junk in a bag and ran it down to the vets.

Turns out it was, in simple terms, a ’snake misscarriage’.

The photo is gross, but I want to share it with anyone who is a snake owner so perhaps save yo some extreme worry if you see this in your cage. Even if you dont plan onbreeding or havent paired up snakes yet- its still good to know because Abbey was never paired up at all.



Its gross. and was extremely scarry to see in the cage.

Details on the snake- Abbey is 2 years old, weights aprox 1500 grams. Never paired up, not cooled or anything to prep her for breeding ( other than feeding her good).

Vet said this could have just been an oddity from her maturing, stress related, poor nutrition. Neither of which I could pinpoint on could be causing it- no changes to her cage or temps, she eats great on f/t feeders I raise myself.

Now, the bad news is it could be a bad ovary, growth or something not going right with the snake. I havent noticed any odd lumps in her or anything. He says it could have just been a one time situation, bu if it happens again, there could be something wrong.

So, my poor girl! He said it wont hurt her ot breed her this season, but I am really leaning towards not even pairing her up. I am just going to monitor her condition and all for awhile. And hope it doesnt happen again!

Bt i just wanted to pass this on as some info. I havent tried googling it yet- as soon as I saw it I was on the phone with the vet and on my way there, but I never heard of it before, and I just want to pass the info on.

If anyone knows any info on this, feel free to share it with me!

I am just glad she isnt sick! she is in the snake room, and i was litterally just about to pair her up.

I just hope she is ok, and even if she cannot be bred, I just want her ot have a happy and healthy life!
10/29/09  07:48pm

 #2089829


TheSurfer
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   Message To: Edf   In reference to Message Id: 2089824


 Info Post: Snake miscarried ( gross pic warning)

WOW!! Well first off, I’m glad she is ok!!! But how can she miscarry if she was never paired up?? Was it like the eggs she had been carrying, waiting to get fertilized went bad and she was just removing them?? That’s soooo wild. Well, let us know if anything changes. I’m glad she is ok. And you too, that would have def freaked me out!!!!
-Will
10/29/09  07:57pm

 #2089847


Edf
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   Message To: TheSurfer   In reference to Message Id: 2089829


 Info Post: Snake miscarried ( gross pic warning)

Well, she must have been developing something... I am not really sure. Vet said that the snakes can lay eggs that are not furtile. I believe I red someone postign that their snake laid eggs w/o being paired in a nother forum. But chickens- they lay eggs without them being fertilized ( now, I knwo a snake is different from a chicken).

I am not too sure. But all I know is this girl is a virgin- raised her from a baby, and she never was with any other snakes in my care.

It is very odd indeed huh?

So far, everythign with her is normal- she is deep in shed and she had passed a turd as well as that stuff. We’ll see if anything else happens- I sure hope not! She is one of my fav snakes- one of the normals I plan to always have. I just hope things keep going well.



10/29/09  09:14pm

 #2089868


Anouk
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   Message To: Edf   In reference to Message Id: 2089847


 Info Post: Snake miscarried ( gross pic warning)

Thanks for posting the pic. I have never seen anything like that before. It is good she passed them and didn’t have to go through the stress of laying them or becoming egg bound. I, too, had heard that females can lay eggs with no fertilization, but did not know if it was true or not until now. I’m glad she is fine and hope she stays healthy.

I sure am glad Anouk is a boy!
10/29/09  10:10pm

 #2089890


Edf
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   Message To: Anouk   In reference to Message Id: 2089868


 Info Post: Snake miscarried ( gross pic warning)

lol, yeah, sometimes it seems males are the luckier gender...;)

I figured it would be best to share this just so other people know. I mean, if you see soemthing liek this in your tank/tub from a female- i would still bag it and take it to the vet. ANd be aware that she ’sluggedout’ in an odd way in case it means something else is wrong. Believe me, the fear of seeing that again is present, b/c if i see it again, somethign may be wrong. In the end, all I really want out of Abbey is a happy healthy pet. If she cant breed for any reason, I am fine with that- yes, i will be dissapointed a littl eb/c i think she is a looker, but in th eend, all my snakes are pets first, breeders second. But I really do not think this is a common thing- so I am not saying this shoudl be a constant fear in any keepers/breeders mind, but just one thing to be aware of. I mean, think of it this way- how many posts on here have you seen of someones ball laying eggs w/o being paired? Even on huger boards there isnt an over abundance of them- i think i only cam eacross one post on another forum about it, and that’s it.

My speculations is: ( if I am correct in my understanding of a female snakes reproductive cycles and such) that she was maturing, and snakes do build folicles- normally if they arent fertilized, they get reobsorbed. I read snakes can go to the next step w/o fertilization, which is ovulation. So, abbey ovulated...

Maybe because I was feeding her nice sized meals for breeding, it was just too much and she expelled the unfertilized eggs ( slugs) early on. Maybe the fact that she was deep in shed caused it. Or, maybe her maturing body finally realized hey, this ain’t gonna be worth it/not how its suppose dto go, and she just let them go? Or- somethign can be wrong with her ovary or something in her reproductive organs is not right- just a defect she was born with that only reared itself in her maturity.

I can’t seem to find anything on google about the topic tho. All I find is slugs that were found in clutches of eggs- be it a few or the whole clutch slugged out. I just want to learn more about it, to see if maybe I can figure out why this happened, or what else could possibly be wrong.

If I see them again, then its time to get the snake x-rayed to see whats going on in her inside, and take it from there. Maybe she will need surgery to fix the problem. Maybe this was a one time fluke and I will never see it again. All I know is I want her to be healthy and not in pain.
When she finishes shedding, I am going to feel for any lumps or anything out of the ordinary.

But I am glad its not a sickness. I feared it was huge loogey balls from a severe RI that some how I missed- which would be inpossible- i mean, we are talkign about weeks of neglect for that to happen! I’d have to miss the wheezing, the gurgles, open mouth breathing, drool, and lets not forget the feedings! That was part of the reason i was so baffled- she was offered food 5 days ago, so I saw her and everythign looked fine. But i am just happy its not threatning to the other snakes since she is in the snake room.

But if I find anything on this topic, I will add on to this thread what I uncover.
10/29/09  10:57pm

 #2089894


Flameethrower
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   Message To: Edf   In reference to Message Id: 2089890


 Info Post: Snake miscarried ( gross pic warning)

Please everyone keep in mind female snakes once mature will at times lay infertile eggs without being paired. Its like their menstruating cycle. Its common more often in colubrids and does happen in pythons.


Itll either look like the above picture or will look like full sized eggs that she protects like normal fertile ones. If this happens jsut take them out as she lays them and toss them out.

Very rare will you have a snake with both sex organs capable of laying fertile eggs.



10/29/09  11:02pm

 #2089897


Edf
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   Message To: Flameethrower   In reference to Message Id: 2089894


 Info Post: Snake miscarried ( gross pic warning)

Of all the info I read on breeding and all, i never expected or read about them not really resembling eggs at all- hence my scare! lol.

do you have any clue why they were expelled so early? dont get me wrong, ia m glad she didnt have to go through the whole process with actual slug eggs, but I am just generally curious and cannot find any info about it online.

How often has this been noticed? Of all the females I have, this is the first time i witnessed it... if she keeps giving me these jelly slugs, i wouldnt think it would be normal, would you?
if you got any links to info I can read on this Rich, I would greatly appreciate it!
10/29/09  11:14pm

 #2089910


Nate304
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   Message To: Edf   In reference to Message Id: 2089897


 Info Post: Snake miscarried ( gross pic warning)

i only have one thing to say. im glad the vet made sure she was ok. after all thats what is important.
10/30/09  12:05am

 #2089969


Flameethrower
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   Message To: Nate304   In reference to Message Id: 2089910


 Info Post: Snake miscarried ( gross pic warning)

it wont happen all the time. you may see her do it once more in her life or never again. Its common for sexually mature females to do it once in thier life.

I had female corn snake just over a year old lay 6 infertile eggs.
10/30/09  08:08am

 #2089972


Edf
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   Message To: Flameethrower   In reference to Message Id: 2089969


 Info Post: Snake miscarried ( gross pic warning)

I got ya now Rich.

yeah- i re,member the corn eggs- se, if she droped slug eggs, i would have at least known what they were since i have seen slug eggs before, not the- what i call - jelly eggs!

it wouldnt hav ebeen so scarry if i was aware of thos before I seen them. So, now i at least shared this with others so if they see it, they dont have to go through that initial OMG what is this and is my snake ok speil like I did.

I feel a bit more at ease now. But if I am still gonna feel her for any unusual lumps when she sheds just to be safe.
thanx for sharing your info.
10/30/09  08:14am


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