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Prettykttkat View Profile |
Better Oustalet’s pics
This pic shows the light green on his belly
Hope you guys enjoy the pics! |
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| 07/24/09 06:29pm |
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Julirs View Profile |
Message To: Prettykttkat In reference to Message Id: 2044750 Better Oustalet’s pics
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| 07/24/09 08:14pm |
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Prettykttkat View Profile |
Message To: Julirs In reference to Message Id: 2044804 Better Oustalet’s pics
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| 07/24/09 08:42pm |
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Julirs View Profile |
Message To: Prettykttkat In reference to Message Id: 2044816 Better Oustalet’s pics
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| 07/24/09 08:44pm |
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Julirs View Profile |
Message To: Julirs In reference to Message Id: 2044818 Better Oustalet’s pics
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| 07/24/09 08:47pm |
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Prettykttkat View Profile |
Message To: Julirs In reference to Message Id: 2044821 Better Oustalet’s pics
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| 07/24/09 09:10pm |
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LunaC View Profile |
Message To: Prettykttkat In reference to Message Id: 2044750 Better Oustalet’s pics
Personally, I say keep the lines as pure as possible and pair him with an Oustaleti beauty queen, not an Ambanja/Tamatave or other locale. Whatever your decision, you’ve done this guy proud :) |
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| 07/24/09 11:09pm |
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Prettykttkat View Profile |
Message To: LunaC In reference to Message Id: 2044879 Better Oustalet’s pics
I have been looking around for the past couple weeks at females while I have been contemplating breeding him. He just gets better looking every day! So, I have made up my mind to breed him today and I have found two suppliers that have females. One supplier says their oustalet’s came in with Ambanja and Nosy be panther chams. The other supplier has no idea where his came from. Both females are young so I don’t know what they will look like as adults. I really want to find the best match possible for him so I just contacted a pro and sent him a picture of Rex. I asked him if he was from Ambanja. He emailed me back and said no. This is what he said "Hard to tell morphs from pictures but certainly not from Ambanja. Ambanja oustaleti have a rounded "helmet" (yours has a pointed helmet) and prominent dark brown, almost black "eye balls".with yellow just below and above the eye. Your oustaleti is probably from Tulear or another locality in the South West but could be from the Ambositra region too. Nice animal." Wasn’t that nice of him to take the time and look at him for me:) I just emailed him back and asked him which female would be the best match for him and sent him the pics of the females for sale. I hope he can tell with them being so young. Luna do you know of an oustalet’s beauty queen available anywhere that you had in mind? I need to do something soon because I have no idea how old Rex is and if he can still breed. I wish I knew how old he was! |
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| 07/25/09 12:59am |
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LunaC View Profile |
Message To: Prettykttkat In reference to Message Id: 2044916 Better Oustalet’s pics
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| 07/25/09 09:42am |
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Jonas77 View Profile |
Message To: LunaC In reference to Message Id: 2044983 Better Oustalet’s pics
I really think you should breed that one, it would be a shame not to add it to the gene pool. One step closer to not needing the horrible WC-industry that mistreat animals in a way that is unacceptable. |
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| 07/25/09 10:17am |
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Julirs View Profile |
Message To: Jonas77 In reference to Message Id: 2044996 Better Oustalet’s pics
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| 07/25/09 01:14pm |
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Prettykttkat View Profile |
Message To: Jonas77 In reference to Message Id: 2044996 Better Oustalet’s pics
This is his reply and he also sent a photo of an Ambanja male’s head that I will post under it. "As you suspected, it is impossible to say something reasonable about the origin of juveniles on photos. I can tell you though that I would estimate that there is about 90% chance that oustaleti imported are from the Antananarivo/Ambatolampy region and less than 10% that the animals originate from the Tulear region. Very few animals come from Ambositra and even fewer from Ambanja. This is for commercial reasons. There are specialised oustaleti "hunters" in the Antananarivo/Ambatolampy region where the species is common, even in the town center and in people’s yards. Oustaleti from Antananarivo are the cheapest oustaleti an exporter can get and because importers overseas generally do not care what local of oustaleti they get and pay the same price no matter what locality, almost every oustaleti exporter is from the Antananarivo/Ambatolampy region. Exporters are also all based in Antananarivo so it is convenient to get animals from not to far away. No matter with what panther locals oustaleti come in with, it is always unlikely the oustaleti are from the Ambanja region. I have never seen an oustaleti on Nosy Be myself but they may occur there as Ambanja is not far from Nosy Be island. Even juvenile oustaleti from Ambanja have the characteristic yellow around the eye as on the attached picture of an adult male from Ambanja so the juveniles in the first two pictures are most probably not from Ambanja. I wish people would care more about oustaleti locals. I am glad you do care. It is a formidable species with very interesting local variation. I would not be surprised if a splitting taxonomist would one day describe the Ambanja form as a distinct species and oustaletri from the South West grow much larger than the forms from the Antananarivo/Ambatolampy region, especially specimens from Morondava can be huge and these too would be worthy to be maintained as distinct captive colonies. If I would live in a country other than Madagascar, I would buy several young animals from a single shipment as chances that there are more than one locality oustaleti in a single shipment are slim. In your case, I would either pair your male with an Antananarivo/Ambatolampy or Ambositra female (I think they are , although slightly different, the same phenotype). In the meanwhile , please spread the word that oustaleti "morphs" should not be mixed. If enough people ask, may be one day exporters here will care." This is the photo he sent of an Ambanja male
Isn’t this all very interesting! So basically he is saying I am probably not going to find a Tulear female. I did do a little more searching and found a female I think would be the best match I can find for him. I saw an ad on chameleon forums for a pair of oustalets. The male pictured in the ad is the closest looking one to mine I’ve seen so far and I’m guessing the female is from the same place as the male. The male’s head shape and coloration on the face is similar to mine but he does not have the pretty body color mine has. The female is very pretty I think:) The guy wants to sell them as a pair so I am getting both! They are 10-11 months old and originally came from Jim Flaherty aka "The Chameleon Company". If you want to see what the pair look like go here to the ad http://www.chameleon forums.com/almost-ready-breed-10-a-27414/ (take the space out between chameleon and forums) What do you think about this pair? Do you think this female is a good match for my male? I think I am going to start a breeding line of this locale(my Tulear? male) and not dilute it with any other oustalets from other areas once started. I hope to establish a pure locale breeding line and hope that other people do the same. I really don’t know why people don’t care about this more and after reading what the herpetologist said I feel it is important to not mix locales. It seems that people only do this (keep locales seperate) for Panther chameleons. What do you think about this? |
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| 07/25/09 01:48pm |
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Jonas77 View Profile |
Message To: Prettykttkat In reference to Message Id: 2045133 Better Oustalet’s pics
Trying to find out what locale this chameleon is by looking at its phenotype is a bit iffy. You can never be sure about a geographical origin if you dont get it from that area directly. Unfortunatly I would have to say that you can not go full out and start selling offspring from this animal as a pure locale - ever. You can assume and certainly breed best you can from how it looks, but you should let the buyers know that you can never be sure about this animals origin. |
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| 07/25/09 02:29pm |
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Prettykttkat View Profile |
Message To: Jonas77 In reference to Message Id: 2045159 Better Oustalet’s pics
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| 07/25/09 04:40pm |
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LunaC View Profile |
Message To: Prettykttkat In reference to Message Id: 2045133 Better Oustalet’s pics
And yes, I totally agree with not pairing with an Ambanja (I think I stated that already though) Also, glad you went with Jim; you won’t be disappointed and you will have beeuteeful babies! Tell him Laura in ATL said "hi" :) |
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| 07/25/09 04:45pm |
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LunaC View Profile |
Message To: Julirs In reference to Message Id: 2044821 Juli ...
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| 07/25/09 04:50pm |
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Prettykttkat View Profile |
Message To: LunaC In reference to Message Id: 2045222 Better Oustalet’s pics
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| 07/26/09 02:06pm |
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Julirs View Profile |
Message To: Prettykttkat In reference to Message Id: 2045645 Better Oustalet’s pics
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| 07/26/09 02:17pm |
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Prettykttkat View Profile |
Message To: Julirs In reference to Message Id: 2045651 Better Oustalet’s pics
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| 07/26/09 06:23pm |
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