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 #2067272


Dirge337
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 Do they lose weight as they get older?

My 4 year old veiled is eating alot, but he is losing a lot of weight. This just started happening recently. Its not parasites, hes been checked. Ive been trying to fatten him back up. Ordered some hornworms, butterworms, and silkworms. Today he ate about 10 crickets and 2 full grown hornworms without a problem. Is it just his age?

Thanks
09/03/09  05:42pm

 #2067488


Jonas77
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   Message To: Dirge337   In reference to Message Id: 2067272


 Do they lose weight as they get older?

Hard to say, or even impossible actually.

In general they should not loose weight as a result of age itself. Things that is connected to age could have that effect, different organ failures etc.

4 years is not that old, eighter way the state of the animal is what is important; of course it could loose a lot of weight if it was over weight before. If it is becomming underweight to the point where it is a health issue, then it is obviously a problem.

Pictures?
09/04/09  07:27am

 #2067828


Dirge337
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   Message To: Jonas77   In reference to Message Id: 2067488


 Do they lose weight as they get older?

I have one.. Ill get more soon.



09/05/09  01:04am

 #2067865


Dirge337
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   Message To: Dirge337   In reference to Message Id: 2067828


 Do they lose weight as they get older?

I got some more while he was sleeping. He seems to be getting worse by the day. That picture was about a week ago. This is now. I’m going to take him in soon. To see if the vet has any answers.

Hip and Tail Bones



Tail Bones



Spine Bone



Closer Spine



Hip and Spine



09/05/09  02:46am

 #2067916


Julirs
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   Message To: Dirge337   In reference to Message Id: 2067865


 Do they lose weight as they get older?

How much is he eating? He is pretty darn thin. Have you done a fecal to check for parasites?
09/05/09  09:13am

 #2068028


Dirge337
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   Message To: Julirs   In reference to Message Id: 2067916


 Do they lose weight as they get older?

Hes eating a lot. I’m giving him more fatty foods. Waxies, Hornworms, Butterworms. Ive done a fecal before and he was clear. I’m going to have to get him checked again. It was only about a week and a half ago. August 29th, because i was thinking of breeding him. But not anymore in this state obviously.



09/05/09  12:48pm

 #2068166


Jonas77
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   Message To: Dirge337   In reference to Message Id: 2068028


 Do they lose weight as they get older?

Make sure you use a good gutload. Fatty food is not necessarily good just because he is thin.

Hes not that old, but without knowing how the living conditions have been, its hard to say anything about it. It COULD be aging factors involved, this being the body/organs shutting down.

Something must be done, if the vet cant find a reason you might have to think about some depressing alternatives.
09/05/09  08:42pm

 #2068213


Dirge337
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   Message To: Jonas77   In reference to Message Id: 2068166


 Do they lose weight as they get older?

Ill start giving him Silkworms and Hornworms until he gets better. Or if he gets better. Ive talked to a few chameleon breeders and one has told me it sound like hes on his last leg.

I understand what will have to be done if there are no answers. He has/had a good life i believe :)

Thanks for all the responses. Ill keep you updated.
09/05/09  10:53pm

 #2068227


LunaC
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   Message To: Dirge337   In reference to Message Id: 2068213


 Do they lose weight as they get older?

Oh my .... yes, he looks very thin. Dangerously thin and I’m afraid it does look ominous.
I know you say he’s eating. Is he drinking? How do you administer his drinking water?

How old is his UVB bulb? What is the average humidity in his enclosure and how do you keep it raised to an appropriate level?

4 years isn’t exactly old old, but it could be part of rapid aging and deterioration. Genes, history and husbandry all play a role in longevity, so it’s difficult to say just how long one cham will live over another.

I think I would lower the branches in his cage also ... to avoid accidental injury in the event he falls. Not saying he will, but with age and obvious deterioration it certainly can happen.

I might also increase humdity and water intake and make sure feeders are getting a good, nutrious gutload (I think this was already mentioned). Be careful of over-supplementing right now and rely on healthy feeders over powdered supplements.

Good luck with your guy. I’m hoping for the best.





09/05/09  11:45pm

 #2068229


Dirge337
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   Message To: LunaC   In reference to Message Id: 2068227


 Do they lose weight as they get older?

I make sure he drinks from the mister every morning and afternoon. Usually by night, hes been asleep.

I just switched out his UVB bulb (Repti-Sun 10.0) about a week ago, so its brand new. The average humidity is about 70-80% and i use trash bags around his cage to keep moisture in. I learned the trick a long time ago when i was little and dug a huge hole in the ground which i covered with an old satellite dish and trash bags wrapped around it :)

I have a ficus in the cage with sturdy branches. But he could hit them on the way down. Ill move his branches down a bit.

Thank you very very much for all your help.
09/06/09  12:00am

 #2082627


Snakesgalore
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   Message To: Dirge337   In reference to Message Id: 2068229


 Do they lose weight as they get older?

im very sorry to see your cham looking like that i hope you can take him to a vet soon have you ever tried pinkie mice i know they are very fatting i use to feed them to my beardies every once and a while and even my male veild gets them as a treat they are full of calcium with the bones and really fatty it might help put some weight back on just dnt over feed them they can be addicting so mabe 1 ever 2 weeks aswell os hornds and silks just a thought it might help
10/10/09  09:54pm

 #2082965


LunaC
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   Message To: Snakesgalore   In reference to Message Id: 2082627


 Do they lose weight as they get older?

Quote:

have you ever tried pinkie mice i know they are very fatting i use to feed them to my beardies every once and a while and even my male veild gets them as a treat they are full of calcium with the bones



Sorry, but pinkie mice provide very little calcium and should NOT be relied upon for necessary or extra calcium. A pinkie’s bones are not yet calcified, therefore they contain more cartilege than calcium. A pinkie would still have to be dusted in order to use it for the sole purpose of calcium supplementation.



10/11/09  11:27pm

 #2082970


Snakesgalore
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   Message To: LunaC   In reference to Message Id: 2082965


 Do they lose weight as they get older?

kk sorry for that missinformation they still are very fatty thou
10/11/09  11:41pm

 #2084213


Dirge337
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   Message To: Snakesgalore   In reference to Message Id: 2082970


 Do they lose weight as they get older?

I don’t think pinkies would be good for him at this stage. His stomach might reject it.

UPDATE=

Hes still the same as before. Nothing that the vet could find either. He just said to make his last couple months or so happy. Hes still eating fine, just staying very thin. He may have gained a few grams from all the silks, but nothing since then. Last time i took him to the vet, he was a weight of 380-450 grams, not overweight, just a big boy. I don’t remember the exact number. Hes somewhere between 18 inches to 20 inches. He never keeps his tail uncurled enough for me to measure him. Now hes only about 150 grams :(. for him apparently that’s "lethal". I’m just making him happy and comfortable, moved the branches down as suggested. He hasn’t fallen at all, but i can tell his grip is lessening.



10/15/09  10:36am

 #2084953


LunaC
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   Message To: Dirge337   In reference to Message Id: 2084213


 Do they lose weight as they get older?

Sorry to hear he hasn’t improved, but I’m not terribly surprised. You’ve done well to keep him for 4 years. Sadly so many others don’t even see their 3rd year.

As you said, happy and comfortable is about all you can do. He’s lucky to have such a competent and thoughtful keeper :)





10/17/09  12:05am

 #2085300


Dirge337
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   Message To: LunaC   In reference to Message Id: 2084953


 Do they lose weight as they get older?

Thanks :)
10/17/09  11:54pm

 #2089660


Jonas77
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   Message To: Dirge337   In reference to Message Id: 2085300


 Do they lose weight as they get older?

You should really consider euthanizing him if there is no improvement. I find it hard to believe that the vet did not consider this option.

Looking at that condition, there is a huge risk that he might be suffering. I always think that in a case where you cant know if the animal is suffering, but there is a great risk it is, then the best option is to be safe before sorry and go ahed and put it to sleep.
Letting him "self destruct" over the course of months is not a good option.

Many animals (and chameleons in particular) hide their sick conditions so they will not loose the chanse to mate or loose their territories. They biologically "lie". This is why it often takes an experienced eye to spot early sickness in chameleons, and why many people find that they get sick and die very rapidly - while in fact the animal had been sick for a while without showing it.
10/29/09  11:13am

 #2096848


Dirge337
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   Message To: Jonas77   In reference to Message Id: 2089660


 Do they lose weight as they get older?

Ive been feeding him Silkworms the past few weeks. Hes still thin but he is eating. The vet asked me to watch him, keep an eye on him and if he does not improve, to bring him back and it will be determined whether or not to let him go. Ill have to weight him and see if hes gained weight. Hes starting to crawl to the bottom of the ficus and sleeping there, which is not like him. BUT, he seems more alert than he was before. Hes not sleeping during the day anymore, and he is eating as soon as i put a worm in. I was told that they can be picky. But can they be so picky that they will just starve themselves?



11/19/09  11:33am

 #2096924


Jonas77
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   Message To: Dirge337   In reference to Message Id: 2096848


 Do they lose weight as they get older?

Most animals wold never starve themselves due to pickyness. I have never found calyptratus to be picky though, they can eat crickets to no end without ever getting picky.
11/19/09  05:09pm

 #2096990


LunaC
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   Message To: Dirge337   In reference to Message Id: 2096848


 Do they lose weight as they get older?

I have to agree with Jonas ... an animal won’t starve to death due to being particular about it’s food. If it’s hungry enough, it will eat.

I’m glad to hear he’s still eating, staying awake during the day and more alert. Try adding some roaches or Phoenix worms to his diet if he’s shying away from crix.



11/19/09  08:20pm

 #2097038


Dirge337
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   Message To: LunaC   In reference to Message Id: 2096990


 Do they lose weight as they get older?

Yes ma’am :).



11/19/09  11:39pm

 #2097198


LunaC
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   Message To: Dirge337   In reference to Message Id: 2097038


 Do they lose weight as they get older?

Please ... no ma’am stuff. "Your Highness" will suffice.

Or failing that ... "ok, whatsyourname" works too :)



11/20/09  06:05pm


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