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 #1771511


R1ashad
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 Switching from mice to rats! ADVICE

OK so I’m new to the Blood World and my baby male blood has already taken 1 large live mouse for the last 4 weekends in a row like it was my bloods last supper. I currently have a plentiful supply of small to large f/t weaned rats from my bp food freezer. I initially tried to feed a small weaned after acclimating for only 1 week instead of 2 weeks because blood look very thin.

(Thinking to myself it’s got to be starving, pic is blood shortly after arrival thru mail........male blood is 3 mos old and 17.8" in length)
I usually take the f/t rat and place in ziploc freezer bag, pour hot tap water into a large cup and place the freezer bag with froze rat in the cup till rat is thawed. I then dump the water out and replace with more hot tap water for about 5-10 mins to make sure the rat is warm, and then I present prey in a live rat like motion with tongs in the snakes enclosure. I have tried feeding rats first on 3 different feeding occasions out of the 4 feedings and my blood has always taken the mouse last within only seconds after the mouse entered the snakes cool hide.

(Blood after 3 large live mouse feedings........notice the difference in body and tail girth)

ANYONE HAVE SOME HELPFUL ADVICE FROM PERSONAL EXPERIENCE?
06/24/08  12:16am

 #1771542


Python_Pete
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   Message To: R1ashad   In reference to Message Id: 1771511


 Switching from mice to rats! ADVICE

I always let my frozen rats thaw out in a plastic bag overnight. The next morning I let the rat sit on top of the enclosure for a few minutes (open bag, letting the scent out), then close the plastic bag w/rat and soak in a pan of very hot water (as hot as you can get out of the tap). By now the rat is completely thawed and warm to the touch - that is when I put it in the feeding Tupperware and throw the snake in after it. I leave snake and rat alone in a quiet place with dim lights. It may take up to half an hour, but the snake will eventually eat. My blood (Crunch) is now used to the routine; he now nonchalantly slides over and swallows the rat (sometimes without constricting it first).

Do not overheat the rat - they tend to explode if the snake constricts it. Very nasty.
06/24/08  12:58am

 #1771702


Littleindiangirl
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   Message To: Python_Pete   In reference to Message Id: 1771542


 Switching from mice to rats! ADVICE

Yup, here’s some tricks that worked getting one of my snakes off of mice to Rats.

We went to a local pet store and asked for some soiled MOUSE bedding. Just the dirtiest we could find. They put it in a cup for us.

When we got home, we brought the weanling rat out from the freezer (60 grams), put him in a large ziplock baggie, threw the soiled MOUSE bedding in with it and let him thaw on the counter while we were at work.

When it was getting time to feed, we took out the soiled mouse bedding and put it near the enclosure. Sometimes we even put it right in the enclosure to prescent for a 1/2 an hour.

While your prescenting, put the rat and ziplock baggie into some hot water. After a half an hour, pull him out, give the rats head a nice blast from the hair dryer to make the head really warm and offer to the blood.

Try this method, if he doesn’t strike, leave it in with him overnight. If he still doesnt eat, I have some more tricks up my sleeve. ;)
06/24/08  09:05am

 #1772030


Snakey68
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   Message To: Littleindiangirl   In reference to Message Id: 1771702


 Switching from mice to rats! ADVICE

In over 20 years of keeping and breeding snakes I have always used the same method 99% of the time.

Let the rat thaw over night, following evening ( sneakily steal :-) ........or borrow I should say the hairdryer) blast the rat for a minute then blast the head area on full heat for same amount of time.

Offer with tongs if you like or see if they will take it static, Bloods are usually very eager and aggressive feeders so most will strike as soon as the rat is in range some however prefer to find it in their enclosure or feeding tank.

There are other little tricks as well but I only ever have to use them with Royals ( Balls ) which can be really picky sometimes. lol



06/24/08  02:24pm

 #1772841


R1ashad
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   Message To: Python_Pete   In reference to Message Id: 1771542


 Switching from mice to rats! ADVICE

Insides of a mouse coming out the rear, SUPER GROSS!!!! I almost threw up from the look and smell last time that happened.
06/25/08  02:52am

 #1772844


R1ashad
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   Message To: R1ashad   In reference to Message Id: 1772841


 Switching from mice to rats! ADVICE

Definitely going to try the hairdryer method first and see what happens......thanks for everyone’s advice
06/25/08  02:58am

 #1773025


Snakey68
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   Message To: R1ashad   In reference to Message Id: 1772844


 Switching from mice to rats! ADVICE

yeah one of the reasons letting it thaw out naturally and then blasting with a dryer is you wont get that over heating you can do in hot water etc.

the water method is fine if timed right however I am not saying you shouldn’t do it, its all down to preference I happen to prefer the method I use after trying several over the years.
06/25/08  09:26am

 #1774570


Crisco
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   Message To: R1ashad   In reference to Message Id: 1771511


 Switching from mice to rats! ADVICE

I don’t really know any thing about switching blood, I just wanted to say how good he/she look now. It looks like you doing a really good job with him/her. Hope he/she starts taking them rats for you soon.
06/26/08  04:17pm

 #1775161


R1ashad
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   Message To: Crisco   In reference to Message Id: 1774570


 Switching from mice to rats! ADVICE

Thank you, I also finally figured out a name for my male blood. I named him, "Hellboy" like the movie! I will buy a small blow dryer this weekend and offer a f/t weined rat, and if not sucessful then I will hold off feeding and offer next weekend again.
06/27/08  12:42am

 #1777686


Buddy1
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   Message To: R1ashad   In reference to Message Id: 1775161


 Switching from mice to rats! ADVICE

wow! those are cool
06/29/08  04:26pm

 #1778268


R1ashad
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   Message To: Snakey68   In reference to Message Id: 1773025


 STRIKE 1

Well Hellboy refused to eat this weekend after trying the hairdyer method Friday and Saturday; however he actually did come out of his hide and show more interest when I introduced the rat this time around. Seem like after he taste the air several times just decided not to strike. I almost bought a another live mouse today for him because it’s awesome watching him feed, but I held off. Will try again next weekend.
06/30/08  12:56am

 #1778568


Littleindiangirl
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   Message To: R1ashad   In reference to Message Id: 1778268


 STRIKE 1

You say he never refused a live prey item? How long did you prescent for and how hot did you make the prey’s head?
06/30/08  12:19pm

 #1778752


Rebelyell83
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   Message To: Littleindiangirl   In reference to Message Id: 1778568


 STRIKE 1

get a live rat pup or a live small rat weanling and try that,i’d try the pup first though.its mosue sized,but rat taste
06/30/08  04:03pm

 #1780094


R1ashad
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   Message To: Littleindiangirl   In reference to Message Id: 1778568


 STRIKE 1

Never refused live mouse.

Prescent for about 10 mins when he usually will strike less than a minute and even left the rats head visible outside in front of his hide entrance for a few hours afterwards.

Warmed rats body for 10 minutes on low heat and then blasted head on high heat for about 5 mins.

Used this method on my BP this past week and my male struck quickly.
07/01/08  09:38pm

 #1780107


R1ashad
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   Message To: Rebelyell83   In reference to Message Id: 1778752


 STRIKE 1

Petco here only carries live small to medium-large rats which are too large for my 18" 200g baby blood.
07/01/08  09:50pm

 #1780113


R1ashad
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   Message To: R1ashad   In reference to Message Id: 1780094


 STRIKE 1

By the way, the rat was already slight at or above room temp. after thawing out in freezer bag in hot tap water before I hit it with the blow dryer.
07/01/08  09:56pm

 #1783338


R1ashad
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   Message To: R1ashad   In reference to Message Id: 1780113


 STRIKE 2

Hellboy refused blow dried f/t wiened rat again!!! This really sucks. I know he’s hungry because he was just waiting at the hole of his hide for something to come across.....more like holding out for a mouse to come across. I thought to myself that my Houdini, my male yellowbelly BP, wouldn’t want the rejected rat from Hellyboy since would of not been nice and warm anymore but Houdini took it without compliant. Some snakes are just not as aggressive as some people think.
07/05/08  07:52am

 #1783661


Littleindiangirl
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   Message To: R1ashad   In reference to Message Id: 1783338


 STRIKE 2

My bloods were very wary feeders when we first got them, I would leave the animal in with them overnight if you havent been. Sometimes they eat when no ones around.

Also, I would double check your husbandry (Sorry if i’ve asked you about this before) but bloods often refuse if they are too warm.

I would strive for an ambient of 79-81. Hot spot of 86 if your offering one.

Otherwise, a nice 81-84 is good.
07/05/08  04:01pm

 #1784039


Catfish_82
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   Message To: Littleindiangirl   In reference to Message Id: 1783661


 

Ok, my .02 cents on the matter, have you tried taking a rat pup and rubbing a mouse over it, perhaps to impart a mild mouse scent on the rat? I’m thinking that if you warmed it up using the hairdryer method, then kind of imparted the mouse scent, and he took it, maybe you could do the same thing, using less mouse scent each time until he was taking nothing but rats?
07/05/08  10:40pm

 #1785178


R1ashad
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   Message To: Catfish_82   In reference to Message Id: 1784039


 I GAVE IN

Feed Hellboy a live large mouse yesterday. He took it like a veteran.
07/06/08  10:35pm

 #1785419


Crisco
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   Message To: R1ashad   In reference to Message Id: 1785178


 I GAVE IN

You could try, same size rats as a Mose just live, or try getting him to eat the mice f/t then try getting him to eat f/t rats instead of mice. Cuz all the mice u feed are live right, maybe its that they are f/t, and not that they are rats.
07/07/08  04:50am

 #1785810


Snakey68
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   Message To: Crisco   In reference to Message Id: 1785419


 I GAVE IN

patience is certainly a virtue with bloods it can take a little time to get babies on the right track.

As littleindian girl stated often if you leave the rat in over night it will take it or alternatively place in a small box that is dark or even a pillow case or small sack can work. The temps can alter a bloods desire to eat or any snake for that matter so consideration to that also, too hot equals lethargic snake.

You can slice the head of the rat as well to allow some blood to seep out that can also give a good response.

Perseverance and dont snake watch (ie) sit there waiting for it too happen lol One of my blood prefers to eat in solitude and darkness one will take straight off the tongs with no hesitation, snakes may look the same but each have their own little intricate preference.



07/07/08  02:57pm

 #1785942


Littleindiangirl
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   Message To: Snakey68   In reference to Message Id: 1785810


 I GAVE IN

I guess I have completely over looked this little tidbit. Have you been feeding him live mice this whole time, then tried to switch him to FT rats?
07/07/08  04:47pm

 #1785948


Snakey68
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   Message To: Littleindiangirl   In reference to Message Id: 1785942


 I GAVE IN

Quote:

I guess I have completely over looked this little tidbit. Have you been feeding him live mice this whole time, then tried to switch him to FT rats?



yeah me too, if thats the case therein lies the problem.



07/07/08  04:56pm

 #1786076


R1ashad
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   Message To: Littleindiangirl   In reference to Message Id: 1785942


 I GAVE IN

Quote:

littleindiangirl
Post By: I GAVE IN on 07/07/08 at 04:47PM
I guess I have completely over looked this little tidbit. Have you been feeding him live mice this whole time, then tried to switch him to FT rats?


Yes I have, the only problem I have is that the live rats here in town, which is only at Petco, are rats sized small-large.
07/07/08  06:48pm

 #1786089


R1ashad
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   Message To: Snakey68   In reference to Message Id: 1785948


 I GAVE IN

What is the longest or typical timeframe it has taken you all to switch blood python or similar snake from mouse to rat?
07/07/08  06:59pm

 #1786159


Crisco
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   Message To: R1ashad   In reference to Message Id: 1786089


 I GAVE IN

I don’t think you having a problem getting him to take rats, I think it more getting him to take f/t, first get him to take f/t mice, and then try switching to the same size f/t rats.



07/07/08  08:07pm

 #1786755


Snakey68
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   Message To: R1ashad   In reference to Message Id: 1786089


 I GAVE IN

Quote:

What is the longest or typical timeframe it has taken you all to switch blood python or similar snake from mouse to rat?



tbh it depends on the snake some it has taken weeks and some have taken a few months as I said perseverance is the key here.

Its not so much the frozen thawed change that is the hardest as you can always fool a snake into thinking that the prey is alive its the changeover in scent from mouse to rat which are very different.

I would stick with rats and persevere I wouldn’t imo try to switch to frozen thawed mice then to rats. If anything I would offer live rats while the snake is young so your not offering a full grown rat then work to frozen thawed but that live offer would be a last resort for me as I have always managed to switch them over after a time and your snake will get hungry believe me, just after a shed is a great time to offer and check your enclosure is not too hot.

Better to offer in cooler night time temps especially if using supplemental lighting which is switched off at night.

I always feed my bloods at night in temps around the low 80’s.





07/08/08  08:08am

 #1809135


R1ashad
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   Message To: Snakey68   In reference to Message Id: 1786755


 I GAVE IN

After a blood takes it’s first rat after being previously fed mice, how hard or easy is it for the blood to continue feeding on rats? I think next time my blood goes thru a shed cycle, I’ll try switching over to a live rat.
07/26/08  02:48am

 #1816425


R1ashad
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   Message To: Crisco   In reference to Message Id: 1786159


 SUCCESS!!!

So I went to Petco today as normal to get a live adult mouse to feed Hellboy and out of the corner of my eye I notice that they had relatively "small small" rats (larger than weaned rats but on the smaller end of the small rat size). So I said to myself, "why not?" So I selected one live small small rat and one live adult mouse as backup. I even asked the Petco associate to fill the bottom of the cardboard container for the rat with soiled mouse bedding (thanks indiangirl). Offered the rat to Hellboy in his enclosure as usual and he was hesitant at first to strike but still stalking the rat and after about 2 mins, Hellboy snatched the rat into his coils. It was a thing of beauty!
I gave the remaining live adult mouse to my female BP who’s about 850 grams est. and apart of my ivory project. She’s also on target to meet my 1500 gram minimum for breeding since she was 800 grams at 1 year of age. And then after I’ve gotten an ivory BP, I plan on breeding her to Hellboy for some hybrids.
08/01/08  07:26pm
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