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 #2031014


The_Snake_Man
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 Geckos and Frogs

So before everyone gets all crazy and starts saying "NO!!" Hear me out. Now ive had many discussions on this before but im curious if it would work or not. I have a couple of satanic leaf tailed geckos and if you’ve seen one before, you know that they stay really small. Anyways, i thought it would be neat to try a community tank, I have a large exo terra tank and it would be cool if i spent some money and made the tank look like a rain forest theme. So what if i got some dart frogs and kept them together with the leaf tailed geckos. They both stay fairly small and i know that there not gonna try eating each other because they are practically the same size. It would be a cool experiment to see if its possible for 2 different species with some similar requirements live in the same tank. So please, tell me what you think of this and tell me why you think this wouldnt work instead of just saying no.

Jesse
06/29/09  02:54pm

 #2031116


Sh0e
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   Message To: The_Snake_Man   In reference to Message Id: 2031014


 Geckos and Frogs

No. Temps are different. The uroplatus like it cool and they don’t need as high humidity as a dart frog tank. They also need more air flow. I’ve kept both species. They are both relatively expensive and delicate, the uroplatus more so than the darts. If you want to risk it, it’s your buck. They’re also from entirely different parts of the globe and from different biospheres. If you are going to even attempt mixing of any sorts you’ll need much much more experience. At least some experience with both species you plan on putting together.

I can’t really see the appeal to mixing. Each species is beautiful in it’s own right. Why screw around like that? I mean I can understand the temptation, but the cons far outweigh the pros.



06/29/09  05:22pm

 #2031196


Sh0e
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   Message To: Sh0e   In reference to Message Id: 2031116


 Geckos and Frogs

I want to add, that no two rainforests are alike. Just because both species comes from a rainforest habitat, doesn’t mean they require similar requirments. There are also different layers to any rainforest, from the emergent layer and canopy down to the forest floor.

Now that I lectured enough, check out other species from Madagascar. You might have more luck with mantella frogs rather than darts. However most mantellas available are wild caught and come in with worms and parasites, I know, I’ve had several shipments. You’d need to quarantine all animals for about 3 months, get fecals done and I’d do a shotgun medication like pancur or baytril.

Just try listing out the advantages of a mixed tank and comparing it with the disadvantages. I can start you out.
Pros: It looks cool.
Cons: Stress, illness, weakened immune systems brought on by stress, negative competition for territory, negative competition for food...

The success stories I’ve heard about are from people who have maintained their tanks form a few months to 1-2 years at most. The problem stories I’ve had are much more frequent. You can’t claim success unless your animals live out their life exptancies in your set up. There’s a lot against that happening.
06/29/09  07:48pm

 #2031329


Rrrragdoll
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   Message To: Sh0e   In reference to Message Id: 2031196


 Geckos and Frogs

Well also it is worth stating that the Large Exo is only 26 gals so that is not a big tank.

The frogs don’t just stay at the top, they go everywhere, especially the darts which spend alot of time on the ground.

The issue is that they will stress each other out. It’s way too close a space to force different species to live since they certainly wouldn’t live that close in the wild. If you were experienced and knew about and kept the species (and they were even species from the same region and requirements) AND you had a 100 gal tank, then maybe you’d have a shot.

Set up a really nice tank with all the colors of broms and other plants and get that going first, then find the inhabitant that you want.

I tried this initially when I started keeping, I had a keeper say that I could easily keep these little yellow headed geckos in with my red eyes. Well two dead geckos later and I see you can’t. They were never seen going to the floor and always hid on the top of the tank. I didn’t know better and I’m trying to save you from the loss of life and money. Now I have nine different cages. Many hold even the same species, but am keeping them separate.
06/29/09  11:42pm

 #2031361


Lovetheleo
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   Message To: Rrrragdoll   In reference to Message Id: 2031329


 Geckos and Frogs

how are satanic leaf tails the same size as dart frogs?

maybe when they are babies but all of the ones i have seen are much larger

so the geckos would be eating food items much larger than the frogs which means the frogs might try eating too large of feeders or they feeders might bite the frogs

plus i agree that is not a very large tank

like the others have said it just isnt worth it
06/30/09  02:45am

 #2031364


Sh0e
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   Message To: Lovetheleo   In reference to Message Id: 2031361


 Geckos and Frogs

Quote:

how are satanic leaf tails the same size as dart frogs?



They are not. And their food items are not. Uroplatus phantasticus as an adult will eat medium crickets, roaches, and similar sized food items. Darts will take pin head crickets, fruit flies, roach nymphs.



06/30/09  02:56am

 #2031544


The_Snake_Man
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   Message To: Sh0e   In reference to Message Id: 2031364


 Geckos and Frogs

I have a 2 satanic leaf tailed geckos and they are small, ive seen the size comparison between dart frogs and leaf tails and there nearly the same. I know that red eyed tree frogs would be out of the question because they would eat the geckos no problem. I thought it might work because they wouldnt bother each other but i dont want to risk it so im not going to. Ill stick to seperate tanks. As for feeding, you would just feed small crickets btw. I think that medium is still big for my satanics.

Jesse
06/30/09  01:36pm

 #2031896


Rrrragdoll
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   Message To: The_Snake_Man   In reference to Message Id: 2031544


 Geckos and Frogs

Ummm, the red eyes wouldn’t eat the geckos. I can hardly get mine to take a cricket over 1/2".

Just not a good idea at all. I’m glad you asked before you did it, most people don’t.



07/01/09  12:23am

 #2032125


The_Snake_Man
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   Message To: Rrrragdoll   In reference to Message Id: 2031896


 Geckos and Frogs

Yea i needed to know if it could be a possibility but im sure an adult female red eyed tree frog can take a satanic leaf tailed gecko no problem. I had red eyed tree frogs before and my female was huge.

Jesse
07/01/09  01:30pm

 #2032287


Sh0e
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   Message To: The_Snake_Man   In reference to Message Id: 2032125


 Geckos and Frogs

Your satanic’s must be very young. Can you post up a picture of them so we can get a look at them? :)
07/01/09  06:33pm

 #2032518


Rrrragdoll
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   Message To: Sh0e   In reference to Message Id: 2032287


 Geckos and Frogs

I’d be curious to see this as well, unless these are tiny babies, I can’t see that happening. Red eyes, even the females are only 3" tip to vent. Their mouth width is maybe an inch wide. Adult satanics are at least 3", even to 5-6".

Regardless I wouldn’t do it.
07/02/09  12:25am

 #2032761


The_Snake_Man
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   Message To: Rrrragdoll   In reference to Message Id: 2032518


 Geckos and Frogs

Yea sure ill post a couple pics. Im not gonna risk it tho so dont worry. Thanks for the replies.










Jesse
07/02/09  01:13pm

 #2032991


Sh0e
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   Message To: The_Snake_Man   In reference to Message Id: 2032761


 Geckos and Frogs

Beautiful shots. I love how they’ll stick out their legs to look like twigs. Those are decent sized. No way a RETF would try to take one down.



07/02/09  06:51pm

 #2033115


The_Snake_Man
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   Message To: Sh0e   In reference to Message Id: 2032991


 Geckos and Frogs

Thanks, it is pretty neat how they hang like a bat but idk, i had a big female before and she looked like she was big enough to take one down.

Jesse
07/02/09  10:48pm

 #2033192


Sh0e
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   Message To: The_Snake_Man   In reference to Message Id: 2033115


 Geckos and Frogs

That must have been an impressive RETF. How long was she? Adult sizes can vary depending on local.



07/03/09  02:58am

 #2033314


Rrrragdoll
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   Message To: The_Snake_Man   In reference to Message Id: 2032761


 Geckos and Frogs

Very cool-looking geckos for sure.

No way IMO though that a red eye could eat one of those though, may go accidentally for a foot or something, but that’s about it.
07/03/09  10:46am

 #2033493


The_Snake_Man
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   Message To: Rrrragdoll   In reference to Message Id: 2033314


 Geckos and Frogs

Oh well, i thought it could since i fed mine baby mice. Then what about red eyed tree frogs, still different requirements? How i think of it, i have plants and moss. Both need about 75 F during daytime. They both eat medium crickets. They both need a high humidity of 70. And neither get really stressed. I dont see what can go wrong in doing it, neither swim either, id put shallow water in and i dont think they would do anything to each other, unless you can tell me whats wrong on doing it.

Jesse
07/03/09  05:03pm

 #2033907


Rrrragdoll
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   Message To: The_Snake_Man   In reference to Message Id: 2033493


 Geckos and Frogs

Again you’re just not getting it. They WILL get stressed just being in there together and it is not a big tank either.

As far as red eyes, they don’t have the same requirements, they need an 80-85F day temp and then CAN go down to 70 or so. Also they are widely know to be easily stressable which is what I’ve been saying from the beginning.

Why is it that you MUST combine animals? They would be happy (your gex) to be in a tank large enough for them to have space and not be encroached upon. Just because they are not exactly "aggressive" doesn’t mean that resource guarding won’t happen, ex. hogging food items, not allowing others to the water areas etc. If a red eye isn’t comfortable and secure going to the water they won’t and that is dire as that is how they stay hydrated, otherwise they will die.

You should create your tank with the gex in mind and use many colorfull plants and interesting branches and climbing areas. Then if you want another species create another tank for them. I have 4 cresteds in 3 tanks (they’re obviously the same species), and a separate tank for red eyes. Then separate tanks for 3 snakes.
07/04/09  02:59pm

 #2034038


Sh0e
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   Message To: Rrrragdoll   In reference to Message Id: 2033907


 Geckos and Frogs

You need to be keeping those satanics cool bro. Like low 70’s. No way a RETF would enjoy that.



07/04/09  07:56pm

 #2072541


Jimboburgess
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   Message To: Sh0e   In reference to Message Id: 2034038


 Geckos and Frogs


i have a tokay, golden gecko and two tree frogs in the same tank. similar requirements, i lean toward worrying about the frogs humidity requirement thour since the geckos are hardier



09/16/09  03:34pm

 #2072547


Mk_ms_reptile
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   Message To: Jimboburgess   In reference to Message Id: 2072541


 Geckos and Frogs

I feel so bad for the frog in with the geckos. Talk about stress. I hate when people do not do what is best for their pets. That’s just sad. There is no reason why not compatible species should be forced to live in the same tank. It’s so selfish on the keeper’s part.
09/16/09  04:02pm

 #2072684


Jimboburgess
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   Message To: Mk_ms_reptile   In reference to Message Id: 2072547


 Geckos and Frogs

Think you can take better care of myfrogs? I’ll send em to you I bought them as geckko food anyway. I’ll ship em you way I don’t want to stress them out if they are motgoing tone just snaapped up



09/16/09  09:33pm

 #2072708


Sh0e
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   Message To: Jimboburgess   In reference to Message Id: 2072684


 Geckos and Frogs

Those aren’t golden geckos. They are Gekko gekko or commonly called Tokay geckos. They are 95% wild caught from south east asia. They hare a very hardy gecko and beautiful. Those frogs you have are green tree frogs native to America. They are pretty much exclusively wild caught. Up to 2/3rds of the wild caught green tree frogs will die in route to pet stores from disease, unclean enviornments, and sitting in their own waste for days at a time. The ones that make it to the stores are often sick. It isn’t a good idea to feed sick animals to your pets. I would try to take them back to the pet store. Then hop over to the gecko forum and ask how to properly take care of your mis-ID’ed gecko.
09/16/09  10:24pm

 #2072908


Jimboburgess
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   Message To: Sh0e   In reference to Message Id: 2072708


 Geckos and Frogs

read my first post better, i know what geckos i have, thanks for your help though



09/17/09  02:15pm

 #2073035


Sh0e
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   Message To: Jimboburgess   In reference to Message Id: 2072908


 Geckos and Frogs

Ah, sorry, I read your post from the other thread and skimmed this one. Plus you never have the golden gecko pictured... I would avoid the gecko forum. Mixing gecko species, like mixing frog species, is highly frowned upon by experienced keepers.



09/17/09  07:20pm


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